• Hi Nmtan!  

    Do we have a breeding calculator on this site?  I was wondering, because sometimes I go to a site that has breeding info, egg pages, and a breeding calculator.  I was wondering if we have something similar and if not, perhaps it might be worthwhile to consider allowing a link to the site to handle some of the breeding questions?

    Btw, I am using the user/breeding results template on my blog to report my breeding attempts.  I got a Leviathan yesterday!  Thanks so much for all your help!  


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    • I like your idea, its good to have a breeding calculator to be more competitive with other site, but there are some limits about this.

      • At this moment, we don't have any breeding calculator :(
      • Our site is Wiki evironment, which has some limits about coding, so making a breeding calculator by wiki maybe impossible. While other sites (I think you refer the they are free environment (php), which enable them to code anything.
      • We can use another way as you suggest - but I prefer to add an iframe for external links, not just the link, so I will look like an part of wiki

      Example: External Page Test I've add external link to this page. I dont know if this way effective but I will give a try. Also I need some time to making code for breeding calculator

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    • Nmtan, I was indeed referring to dragoncity guide.  Because of the limitations of the wiki, I was thinking to just use his breeding calculator.  Also, I didn't want to make more work for you. That is why I suggested linking to his, if that's ok.  I don't think it would be competition for us, because even though his site is nice, there is no place to really discuss things.  I was thinking more of affiliation, where he promotes us on his site and we put a link to his. You, Jens, Nic, Ivan & Cyber would have to talk about that.    It would be cool if we could have one here.  (A lot less breeding questions!)  But any way you think is good is fine with me.  

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    • Nmtan, I checked a little further on that guides "Friends" page and he has already linked to us and given credit to Andy and you.  It reads:

      "Dragon City Wiki

      Dragon City Wiki over at Wikia has the most complete information about the Dragon City game of any site. It’s updated by the community and usually rather quickly. The odds used in the calculator are largely derived from a formula first posted on the Wiki by Andibad. Also check out NmTan’s blog for some good information and examples about Dragon City breeding."

      Pretty cool!  

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    • Woa, I got refered from that site, cool!

      Still working on, the checking posibility dragons step is nearly completed. User:Nmtan/Sandbox/External_Page

      Help me find any error :) I will update code for chances later, and decoration will be the last step

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    • Careful with that PHP. :) Consider that people who are mischievous by nature (like me) will do things like try the calculation for Legend 30 x Legend 30. And get the following:

      CBR-crashed server

      If there's a few people like me...

      Can't you do something with the MediaWiki Extensions I just had installed?

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    • Give my regards to Joseph and remind him that breeding two of the same Dragons will trigger a switch that it will most likely result in another of the same?

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    • By the way, Nmtan -- there's not much of the code we can test.

      However, perhaps it would be good if you group the Dragons in the list, either by element or by earning rate or (probably best) in alphabetical order.

      Perhaps, to avoid having people like me keep your server busy all day long, best to avoid having Legends in the list. :)

      You're gonna see a spike in your resources used data in any case. xD

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    • Now added features:

      • Legend + legend (wildcard + wildcard)
      • Legend + Element (wildcard + element)
      • Special: Element + Element (no result - example: Light + Pure)

      I think atm the step possible result is completed, but still need feed back from you guys.

      P/S: As I said, its impossible for wikia to make a tool like this, function & extension in wikia is poor and limited. And don't worry, you can't spam it, I have some trick to avoid that :)

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    • btw off to school now, see you later :)

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    • Nmtan, I haven't had time to try it yet, but I will test some stuff out!  Cyberdrgn, yes, Joseph is a very nice guy...I already almost gave him a heart attack asking him if he was sure all his calculations were correct since LaW update!  So someone else can ask him about same parents!  :D

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    • lol

      I'll test out the calculator when you're done. :P Try all my tricks to see if I can crash it. xD

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    • its completed, but not for the chance. I need rest now

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    • Looks very good Nmtan. :)

      Is that your own domain? What type of hosting do you have? I have 5 "nodes" at that run about $100/mo (plus some for server monitoring and stuff like that). I would imagine the wiki gets several times as much traffic as my site does. The calculator does take a lot more server resources than the normal blog would. (Assuming you're not pre-computing everything. I considered that, but with so many possible combinations ... most of which will never be used ... it seemed it would be rather unweildy to do so.)

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    • Hi Joe!  Nice to see you!  

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    • Thanks for the reminder on the X + X = X switch CyBeRdrgn. I am aware that's how it used to function with Legends in particular. I haven't done any testing on it lately, but it seems to me that it may no longer apply.

      In the case of Pures, polling in Facebook groups and responses to the site has returned roughly the same odds for Legend from Pure + Pure as for Pure Hybrid + Pure or Pure Hybrid + Pure Hybrid. If there was a switch, I would expect Pure + Pure to perform much worse than the others.

      In regards to Legends, I haven't seen results of Legend X + Legend X = Legend X reported very much since the Light and War update. It used to be relatively easy to get a specific Legend that way, but now I suspect it's been weakened or done away with entirely. (I haven't tested it though. I only have 1 of each ... sans Droconos.)

      It's possible it's just due to the small sample size in both cases. I would need to see evidence of the switch working before accepting it's still there though.

      The reason I tend to that side of things is just basic human nature ...

      I get a lot of flak for not having a result in the calculator that should be in there. It's immediately obvious that I'm wrong if I return a set of eggs that doesn't include the egg someone gets. If I return a set of eggs that includes the egg someone gets, and a superfluous egg, it's not immediately obvious that there's a superfluous egg.

      Also, if the odds are higher than they should be (as happens when the number of eggs returned are reduced), it will lead to more discontent than if they're lower (as happens when the number of eggs is increased). If someone gets the dragon they are after faster than expected, they're happy. If they get the dragon they're after slower than expected, they get frustrated.

      So from my perspective, it's generally safer to give more dragons than less when in doubt ;)

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    • NmTan ... A question specifically about Poo. I see you only return it when a Legend is involved on one side? I've gotten reports of two hybrids with Terra/Sea/Dark between them still resulting in Poo since the Light and War update, but it seems a bit rarer than before (if that's possible), and nothing confirmed. Is it intentional that you've left it out?

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    • Hi Joe. :D

      The old Legendary + Legendary = Legendary majority no longer seems to apply. I was testing for that, but since then Nmtan has concluded more or less that it's no longer true.

      We'll update the Breeding Page as soon as we can, Nmtan was trying to explain to us about the changes, but I think I got lost somewhere along the way, and he's a bit shy about his English (even though I think his English is fine.) As soon as we get it sorted out, there should be an update to the Breeding page.

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    • Actually, you should read Joe's explanation.  It's written so that even I can understand it!  It's broken down to a very basic level and I think it would make more sense to our users. Perhaps Joe would be kind enough to let us use it, with the proper credit, of course! ;) 

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    • Thanks Rianza. There's plenty I'm still not sure of myself...

      I know NmTan understands the system as well as anyone, if not better. :)

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    • Ria, did you read what I wrote?

      The Breeding System info is out of date.

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    • Well, I was thinking temporarily until CyBeRdrgn & Nmtan have time to work it out. :)

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    • Yes, CyBeRdrgn, I'm aware that it is.  I know you guys are working on it. Just sayin'.  No disrespect intended.  

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    • I don't understand. Why would we want to put more information/calculator that we know is outdated in place while we work on the new one?

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    • I'm pretty sure none of us wants to deal with the flak that will surface due to that.

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    • You are saying that Joe's information is outdated?  I'm talking about his explanation since LaW.  Have you read it?  

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    • I'm saying that our Breeding System information is out of date. Anything that is tied to the old one is suspect.

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    • The most up to date one we have at the moment is roughly described in Tutorial/Breeding Legends, unless Nmtan has posted anything new since.

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    • Sigh...I'm going back to work on the Stadium..

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    • Joe, FYI about 20-30% of your Breeding System information may be out of date. The %s from your Breeding Calculator is confirmed to be out of date.

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    • Hi guys, the breeding system of the game is changed majorly since LaW update, we just didn't find out it earlier. Things I know currently:

      • They uses similar algorithm of Monster Legends breeding system.
      • The possible dragons is fully functional in the tool
      • The probability (chance) in the tool is the out-dated version (its the system before the LaW update)
      • Currently, new system don't use Total Rate, Unlock slot, difficulties. So levels of parent dragons are irrelevent (I told you how this system is similar with Monster Legends)
      • With many test breedings, I've gotten how the probability (chance) system works (for both games). And this new system is more easier, simpler than the old one.

      @Josephseeley: I've tested the Poo Dragon, I can confirm with you that its impossible to get one with only hybrids, because breeding hybrids only triggers matching 2 elements together, there no place for the third element. Also it only trigger the "breedable==1" possible dragons.

      Only when there's a wildcard in the breeding, it will seek for all dragons:

      • 1 wildcard + element(s): elemental, hybrid, rare, exclusive that have the specific element(s) (from the not-wildcard parent)
      • 2 wildcard: all breedable dragons (include legends too)

      So, I must say that: Poo (exclusive) is gotten by breeding with atleast 1 wildcard (legend) involve. And the if elements from the other parent are more identical with Poo elements, the chance for Poo will be higher

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    • OK. As of Nmtan's post, this thread now officially contains the most up-to-date info we have on the Breeding System. :)

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    • @Nmtan: I don't see any problems with your explanation. You could have just updated the Breeding System on your own without waiting for us. Bugger the grammar. It's understandable, and that's all that matters at this stage.

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    • I'm thinking about creating new page, with some introductions, and reference to old system page too. Also, since we decide to update the Breeding/System, why don't we update the Breeding/Generations.

      Breeding/Combinations can be updated later, we also need to add some annotation on the relevant pages like difficulty, rating, slots that the new system doens't use this anymore

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    • Agreed!

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    • I just want to say that I still have difficulty understanding it.  Nmtan, you're a genius..but I think you give most of us too much credit to think that we can follow you...because you think at such a high level.  Most of us need you to simplify how you explain things to us.  Especially the younger users may not understand...not because of your English..your English is perfectly fine.  It's just that we are not nearly as smart as you are.  Perhaps if you could give some picture examples when you do the new page.  I still don't know what a wild card is.  Is it a Legend?  What dragons are considered wildcards?  Also, for those of us who have never played Monster Legends, we don't know what that breeding system is a comparison to it will not help us understand it.  Thank you Nmtan...we would be lost without you!  Don't worry about the grammar!  I can fix up any little problem.  It's what I do best!  <3

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    • Thanks for that explanation NmTan. Richmond Nguyen had told me some similar things about the breeding formula being a lot simpler after the Light and War update, but wasn't so explicit about how.

      I had noticed (and been recommending) that Poo and the level exclusives should be bred with Legend + [right elements] but wasn't sure how it was working underneath the hood. Wasn't sure if the non-Legend pairings were still possible.

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    • I missed your comment last night CyBeRdrgn. I've actually been working on a new version of the calculator that doesn't use the old odds formula since before the Light/War update. Just been slow about it... partly because I wasn't sure about some points, partly because I've been busy keeping the current one updated, adding to the site, trying to keep the server ahead of the visitor increases, and doing the yearly visa run-around. Should have the new version of the calculator ready to go soon. :)

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    • Just ask anything you're not sure, If I know I will tell you :)

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    • @Joe: I will come around to test it if you will post the link. xD I can't remember where it is. lol Getting old. I promise I will try to break it. xD I will start with the wildcards.

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    • Thanks for the offer NmTan. I've updated the calculator to take most of what you've said into account. It's probably still off in some places.

      Here's the link CyBeRdrgn: DCG Breeding Calculator

      The site should be a bit more robust than it was a week ago. I've added extra server resources from the host and eliminated a major memory hog portion of the "How To Breed" section. Probably can still get Cloudflare to protest if you send too many requests too fast... but that's by design.

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    • The new calculator is still not implemented yet. That's just some quick hacks to tide me over. In the process of redoing everything from the ground up. Including the theme to be more friendly for mobile devices.

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    • Mobile devices is good. =D Planning to get a new phone today, but unforeseen objections are delaying me... -_-

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    • Actually, Joseph, its not quite 50:50, its a fixed 60:40 between Petroleum:Pirate. The MonsterLegends has this patern too, but the ratio are a bit different: 70:30

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    • Is that ratio based on the first element? Lower level element first is more common than when reversed?

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    • The result's ratio is fixed.

      • Dragon City: To know which monster will be 60 and which will be 40, I think first is compare the Category, then compare the display order. The dragon with higher value will have the less chance in output.
      • Monster Legends: To know which monster will be 70 and which will be 30, I think first is compare the rarity, then compare the breeding time. The monster with higher value will have the less chance in output.

      This is my speculation depending on the results (me mostly and from friends), so I can only explain it statistically, since all the algorithm code are server-side.

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    • Thanks for the explanation. I take it this 60:40 holds true for Mud/Waterfall too?

      I think I may just not implement this due to how easy it is for them to change it without it becoming immediately obvious. (As I suspect was happening in our Mud/Waterfall testing...)

      What happens when those factors you mention are the same? Not sure if it can happen in DC ... I haven't looked at display order enough to recall off the top of my head ... but it can happen in Monster Legends where rarity and breeding time are the same. Most of the Epic pairs for instance.

      Not enough trials/reports to be sure I got them in the right order. It seemed in the cases I looked at that it was the lower level first element that would correspond to the more common result. I wasn't looking at any of the underlying factors at the time so it was all "in-game" analysis. For instance: (might be old breeding times, this was what it was when I was testing ... haven't been able to play my main account for a month now :( )

      Scorchpeg (fire) more common than Skipples (light) - both E, both 35 hours 

      Terracrank (earth) more common than Duchess (magic) - both E, both 27 hours

      Fliploch (water) more common than Razfeesh (dark) - both E, both 20 hours

      Rhynex (nature) more common than Rabidex (thunder) - both E, Rabidex 6.5, Rhynex 5

      Am I right about the relationship between these E's? Rhynex:Rabidex fits what you're saying due to breeding time differences, but the others are the same in regards to both rarity and breeding time (as well as earnings which I first considered given DC's old breeding system).

      That leads to the question, what happens when there's more than just 2 possible results? In Monster Legends it seems the ratios stay the same but the odds of course fall for all results when more monsters are involved. At least outside of Legends, which are a fixed percent as you say,and Epics which I wasn't able to test at all.

      The 70:30 fits closely to my testing. I saw ~3:1 for Firanda:Pandaken when breeding Fire Lion + Panda in over 200 trials.

      I saw ~5:3:1 for Fire Lion:Firanda:Pandaken when using Fire Lion + Pandaken also in over 200 trials.

      I wasn't able to test any combinations that would add an Epic to the mix due to longer breeding times.

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    • on user info is already telling breeding percentage, is 45,40,15 (see as difficult 1:2:3) ....

      when difficulty 3 is not listed on temparrary, difficulty 1 will get extra 15 %. so 60 : 40 ...

      Mud and waterfall will get same chance, is 40 %

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    • So that's how you read that! Thanks, Andi!

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    • Andi, this percentage was the chance modifier before the update and (my oppinion) its only use for breeding special dragons: Rare Dragon & Legend Dragons. My point is new system does not use this, that's why I've tested Sea + Terra = 60% Mud & 40% Waterfall.

      Also if assume that the percentage is still used (dificulty is still used), please explain these result:

      Archangel + War

      • Test: Archangel Dragon: 57.485, War Dragon: 42.5149
      • Andi's: Archangel = War = 50%
      • Tan's: Archangel = 60%, War Dragon = 40%

      Flaming Rock + Volcano

      • Test: Terra Dragon: 25, Flaming Rock Dragon: 32.3353, Flame Dragon: 23.4031, Volcano Dragon: 19.2614
      • Andi's: Terra = Flaming Rock = Flame = Volcano = 25 %
      • Tan's: Terra = Flame = 25%, Flaming Rock = 30%, Volcano = 20%

      Alpine Dragon [7] + Medieval Dragon [7]

      • Test: Flaming Rock Dragon: 16.2674, Armadillo Dragon: 22.8542, Pearl Dragon: 13.972, Cool Fire Dragon: 16.2674, Volcano Dragon: 9.481, Soccer Dragon: 10.5788, Platinum Dragon: 10.5788
      • Andi's:
        • Soccer = 45%
        • Cool Fire = Volcano = Flaming Rock = 40/3 = 13.33%
        • Armadillo = Pearl = Platinum = 15/3 = 5%
      • Tan's: there are 4 cases
        • 25% of f/e => 15% Flaming Rock & 10% Volcano
        • 25% of m/e => Armadillo
        • 25% of f/i => 15% Cool Fire & 10% Soccer
        • 25% of m/i => 15% Pearl & 10% Platinum

      I don't say my calculation is correct, its just hypothesis according to the results I got.

      Infomation (dificulty): Element Light Archangel (3), Element War War (3), Element TerraElement Flame Flaming Rock (2), Element FlameElement Terra Volcano (2), Element Flame Flame (2), Element Terra Terra (2), Element TerraElement Metal Armadillo (3), Element IceElement Metal Pearl (3), Element FlameElement Ice Cool Fire (2), Element IceElement Flame Soccer (1), Element MetalElement Ice Platinum (3)

      P/S: If you wonder how I calculate that, please read my post of new system in DCW Admin group here

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    • Nmtan, I have been using your calculator to try and find a combo for Great White.  I have tried elemental Terra + Sea and hybrid Terra + Sea dragons...none of them give Great White as a result.  What am I doing wrong?  Same for Plankton too.  

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    • Rianza,

      From Nmtan's post earlier:

      "Only when there's a wildcard in the breeding, it will seek for all dragons:

      • 1 wildcard + element(s): elemental, hybrid, rare, exclusive that have the specific element(s) (from the not-wildcard parent)
      • 2 wildcard: all breedable dragons (include legends too)"

      You need to use a Legend to open up the exclusives (or Poo)

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    • Ihavegig
      Ihavegig removed this reply because:
      08:44, September 18, 2013
      This reply has been removed
    • Great White eliment is Terra + Ice. Not Terra + Sea

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    • I see.  And I'm only L-36!  I do have a Legendary dragon but he's in the Nursery!  So I guess I can't try to breed any of these dragons for awhile then.  Thanks Joe!  And you can call me Ria!  

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    • I see.  And I'm only L-36!  I do have a Legendary dragon but he's in the Nursery!  So I guess I can't try to breed any of these dragons for awhile then.  

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    • Thanks Joe.  And me only L-36!  I do have a Legendary Dragon, but he is rocking in the Kindergarten.  I can't get him out until L-38.  So I guess I will have to wait for a bit to breed any of those dragons.  

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    • @ I havegig...I know it's Terra and Ice.  I was saying I couldn't find a combo for Plankton either...geez.  

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    • @Rianza33 ... sorry for my miss understanding

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    • No problem!  :)

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    • Rianza, you need atleast 1 legend for any exclusive breeding :)

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    • Any more problems, Rianza?

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    • Andibad
      Andibad removed this reply because:
      15:35, September 19, 2013
      This reply has been removed
    • CyBeRdrgn, if I do have any more problems, you will be sure to know about it!  Trust!  LOL.  

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    • O.o

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    • Hi NmTan,

      I am wondering if the breeding calculator that you made is still under develop or not.

      Anyway, thank you for everything you made it for the gamers.

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    • That tool uses old breeding system. I'm considering making tool with new breeding system. But there is 1 problem, new system that I figure out is mainly speculation depends on breeding results, and Andi & me still don't have agreements with the new system until now, so I don't want to make one yet

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    • Thank you NmTan.

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    • This is the best disscusion I've ever read, Nmtan, Andy, CbR and Joe here :D

      I am wondering, if parent level doesn't matter anymore, then how breeding boost will work now?

      I never use breeding boost (cost five gem each times you breed), but I will try soon, with level 30 pure and level 30 pure dark. 

      The breeding calculator you've made not include the breeding bost toll. so I'll try something unusual, (maybe I can get legend this way) :D

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    • I am sorry about resurrecting this thread but I wonder if admins would like to collaborate on the breeding calculator.

      I'm author of the popular breeding calculator iOS app for a very similar game (not posting game not calculator app name because I don't want to advertise here).

      This calculator app has around a million downloads so far and I'm currently working on something similar for Dragon City (so there is a good potential for bringing new users to this wiki).

      My proposal is to have cross-references from my calculator app to this wiki and vice-versa (I'm open to discuss details on how it is done). I will be happy to provide admins with access to the beta (any iOS 7 device is required).

      Please drop me a message if you're interested.

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    • A FANDOM user
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